Ep. 12: Lynae Brayboy, MD, Chief Medical Officer, Clue. Topic: Femtech.
Kathy: Hi everyone, and welcome to episode 12 of the Smarter Healthcare Podcast. Our guest today is Dr. Lynae Brayboy, chief medical officer of Clue, a Berlin, Germany-based femtech company. Lynae is responsible for developing Clue’s research in women’s health and will help the startup evolve into a go-to source for women at every reproductive stage: from puberty to menopause.
In this episode, Lynae and I discuss the femtech industry and what she sees as the priorities for women’s healthcare in the next few years. I hope you enjoy our conversation.
Kathy: Thank you Lynae for joining the podcast today. And could you start by telling us what your company Clue is all about.
Lynae: Sure. So, thank you so much for having me. I’m happy to be here. Clue is a company who really values promoting reproductive health. Our long-term goal is to evolve as a source for people with periods at every reproductive stage, from puberty to menopause.
Kathy: And I took a look at your website earlier. You have a lot of content on there. I downloaded your app – you really don’t shy away from anything on there.
Lynae: No, we don’t shy away from anything, really. We try to be inclusive of everyone and everything, because we realize that there are not a lot of resources to talk about things that are not standard. For instance, we have Abortion 101. We have chapters and articles about anal sex. Because we want to make sure that our users are getting evidence-based information that they can use to protect themselves and make sure that they are empowered when it comes to their healthcare and their full sexual lives.
Kathy: And you also have a lot of content on there for the LGBTQIA community as well.
Lynae: We do, because it’s definitely an underserved community, it’s an under-studied community. And what I mean by that is that there are not a lot of studies in individuals who have alternative ways of achieving family, right? There are not a lot of articles or informative evidence-based information about contraception and these individuals, and so we want to try to start a conversation around that. We want to definitely generate data as well, so we’re really interested in partnering with individuals who’d like to study this community in a respectful, culturally competent way so that we can understand more and be able to offer more options.
Kathy: You’re Clue’s first CMO. Could you talk about your background and why you decided to join the company?
Lynae: Sure. So a CMO is a chief medical officer, and I was living in Berlin doing a sabbatical at the time. I am a researcher, so I’m a basic science researcher as well as a clinical researcher, and I came across the company during my sabbatical. I was intrigued by a couple of things: one that we’re based in Berlin. And Berlin is sort of a science mecca, really, and now with Brexit will be moreso even. Especially for Anglophones. And two, it was a tech mecca. And Clue was really a leader in femtech. And I had previously done a research project where I published on a smartphone application that would teach, especially young girls, women of color, about sexual health education, a comprehensive sexual health education, and that was back in 20- oh my gosh, I have to go back now, 2016 is when it was published, I think I applied for the grant in 2012, got the grant in 2013, and then really, at that time, Clue was just starting to take off. So I didn’t know about Clue until I came to Berlin, and was sort of looking at different companies and what they did in terms of femtech, which is a term that Ida Tin, our CEO coined, and I came across Clue that way. And when I talked to my daughter about applying for this position, because she was enthusiastic about staying in Berlin, she goes, “Oh yeah, I know Clue. They’re feminist-based, science-based, I like them.” And at that time, she was 15. So to hear that from a 15-year-old, who definitely saw me struggle to get my research app out there and saw the response from people that I was recruiting and trying to recruit, I think that it was sort of like a natural match. And my father, when I told him about the possibility, he said, in his own words, “Girl, that job’s got your name written all over it.” So I applied, and came back to Berlin after the sabbatical and I’m still doing my basic science as well as holding this position as well.
Kathy: That’s great. What would you say are some of the priorities for women’s healthcare in the next few years?
Lynae: Well, I think education has to be the priority. Really, we’ve seen in this pandemic that evidence-based health education has really worked for some companies to control the pandemic, and – I said companies – countries, to control the pandemic, and in other countries it hasn’t worked. And I think, my mantra is that science can save us if we can save science, and I think that Clue’s mission is to make sure that reproductive science is accessible to everyone. So I think that should be the mission of healthcare in the next few years and we have to think of creative ways to do that. So how do we get the information out there, right? Well, it’s not happening through school. Sexual health education was already very compromised, and general health education in the U.S., and now that kids are learning remotely, maybe it’s one of the things that will be left out completely, and so how do we get that information? Well, everyone, really, very many people have a cell phone, and very many people have a smartphone. That might be the only type of phone that they have. So if we can give individuals evidence-based, science-based content that helps them improve their health, especially when it comes to reproduction, I think what we’ll see is that we will have improved outcomes and will have more collaborative conversations between healthcare provider and patients. So that patients can come to their appointments or do telemedicine, and have their appointments remotely, and have a conversation, moreso than not knowing their options prior to coming to their healthcare provider.
Kathy: I like that – it’s really about getting information to people where they are as opposed to – in some other awkward type of setting.
Lynae: That’s right. And we want to be a go-to source for people with periods and women at every reproductive stage so that they can take that information and they can feel empowered to have a conversation. I’ve had patients pass out when I’m just talking to them. Just because it’s anxiety-provoking. You have to talk about something that you might not be comfortable talking about. I have family members who can’t say the word ‘period,’ right? So how do you have a conversation when someone’s having an issue or problem or pain or they’re not able to conceive or they’re having sexual dysfunction, it can be really anxiety-provoking so we try to help, maybe, facilitate that.
Kathy: You mentioned this term earlier, femtech, which is short for female technology. Can you talk a little bit about the femtech space and what are some examples of how digital technology is helping women?
Lynae: Yeah, well femtech is really a broad term. It’s essentially - when we have all types of technology, so it can be telehealth, telemedicine, it can be mhealth – those are applications – all of those, essentially, belong to femtech, and essentially, as I see it, you ask me what are some examples as well. Besides health apps like ours, there are other also websites, there are other companies that maybe use telemedicine as their model, some companies that provide birth control, access to early termination medications, so all of those things basically encompass femtech. But essentially it’s - the possibilities are endless for users using their own personal data to actually help kind of project, or not project, that’s not the word I’m looking for, but help propel that industry. And that industry I think should be focused on helping to improve healthcare, not just giving information that sounds wonderful, that sounds great, but actually giving information that can help direct and shape the future of healthcare, if that makes sense.
Kathy: And how has this femtech industry evolved over the last several years?
Lynae: Wow, yeah, so when I started my research, at that time I think we did a very thorough literature review to see what femtech smarthealth or smartphone mhealth applications were out there, and we didn’t see very many that actually were evidence-based, or that were comprehensive, and now I think that Clue is still a leader in that space, but there are so many different apps that you could use for various stages, so that’s good. There’s always good to have choice. But the thing that I try to counsel individuals is, how are these apps using your data? Are these apps helping to put money in their pockets, or are these apps helping to shape how healthcare will evolve? And are these apps helping individuals learn more about their bodies? And so, I think, we have lots of different options now. I think that now with the pandemic, femtech will even be even more evolved, and I would say that’s probably one of the few silver linings of the pandemic is that we relied on this brick and mortar office where you see individuals and that’s how we’ve been doing it for hundreds of years, and I think now we’ll see that telemedicine and telehealth will definitely - becomes front and center, because it looks like we’re going to be in this pandemic for a very long time and when you have telemedicine and telehealth, you can have a lot more possibility to interact for a longer period of time, maybe you don’t have to take off work, so then you reduce the time that is lost from your own job but also the provider has more flexibility with the hours that they can offer. So I think that in the future we’ll see that there will be more insurance mandates to continue to cover those visits. I think that individuals, patients, will not want to go back, necessarily, to the old way, unless there’s a reason to come in to the office, or there needs to be a physical exam, there needs to be some type of imaging. I think we are going to see that there’s going to be more ways to access healthcare in the comfort of your own home, in the safety of your own home without exposure.
Kathy: Now you said that it’s important for consumers to know what a company is doing with their data, are they using it to profit themselves? Are they helping healthcare? How can consumers be more informed about something like that and really know some of the motivations of some of these companies?
Lynae: Absolutely. First of all find out where the company that owns the app is located. We’re located in the EU, the European Union, so Berlin, Germany, and what that means is that we have to adhere to strict privacy, data privacy laws, and so we are regulated. We can’t just do anything with a user’s usage data, or health data. Everything is definitely looked at and regulated. And so the other thing that people should wonder about when they’re using different femtech applications is what is done with their data. And do they have a privacy policy? We have a privacy policy that is on our website, helloclue.com, anyone can look at that privacy policy and see that it’s written in plain English, and it is being translated to the other languages that our app is available in, which it’s available in 15 languages right now, and so anyone can read that policy and if they have any questions, we have a support team that is able to help people in all 15 languages, if they have any questions about that policy. What happens to their data? And we are not in the habit of selling individuals’ data. We only use our users’ data to help improve the app and to help work with collaborators who are in academia who have institutional review board permission, so that’s permission to do research, so that we know that we are making our best effort to protect our users from any type of data breaches. As well, we have a tech side, an engineering side, that is making sure that we use industry standards to make sure the data isn’t breached as well. And so those are all things that users, when they are deciding about which app or which mhealth application they should use, they should really consider.
Kathy: What are some of the challenges of being a femtech company?
Lynae: Yeah, well it’s definitely evolving and expanding, but I think one of the challenges is to, one, kind of market to people who understand that we are trying to not only just be a company, but that we want to partner in collaboration with researchers, with industry, with academia, we want to sort of bridge that gap, so I think that’s a newer dimension of femtech. I think also a lot of femtech is male-dominated, and the funding might be a little bit male-dominated, but our company is female-led, our science is female-led, and so trying to get that message out, probably, is a bit of a challenge, and I think that’s important when it comes to femtech. Because in OB/GYN, obstetrics and gynecology, unfortunately there’s a lot of male domination, which you wouldn’t think, but when you look at leadership of different healthcare entities, tends to be very male. So I think it’s a challenge to find companies that are actually female-led. And therefore have hopefully a feminist ideology that puts people with periods first.
Kathy: And for those female-led companies, is it harder to get funding, is it harder to get taken seriously?
Lynae: You know, I would like to think that that is changing, but I think that is the reality. It’s very difficult to come in and say, this is important. Female health, people with periods, their health is important. And I think that’s evolving, but here’s the thing that I think I want your listeners to know is that everyone comes from a person with a period, so it’s important that people who are having periods, who are having children, that their health is valued, that they are studied, and that their outcomes are improved. Right now, unfortunately, the U.S. is leading the industrial world with maternal mortality and morbidity, and if - everyone who is in femtech needs to really address that problem so that down the line the next generation and their subsequent generation, their grandchildren, don’t have those same problems, because we know some of the morbidities can have intergenerational or trans-generational effects. And so it’s better for the health of society if we value female reproduction. So I think that it is difficult to sometimes explain that to different entities that would be supportive of start-ups in femtech.
Kathy: And it seems like to make change there will probably have to be changes in other areas such as in VC companies and having more women work at those companies and see the value in some of the investments.
Lynae: Absolutely, and I think the same goes for research. I mean when you think back in the history of reproduction, a lot of the basic research that has given us some of the things that we take for granted today wasn’t funded by traditional, governmental, federal sources. It was actually funded by private money. So the birth control pill, for instance, in vitro fertilization, all of those things weren’t necessarily mainstream at the beginning. And now of course we couldn’t even think of the world without them.
Kathy: Now what do you think are the most promising areas of femtech investment in the next few years?
Lynae: I think that my forte is definitely not in finance and investment because of my clinical training, but I do think that one of the biggest problems from my point of view is that we really need some basic science innovation, and I think that femtech can work to help promote basic science innovation. I’m an oocyte biologist, or an egg biologist, and I’m really focused on egg quality and providing information about how when you have an egg issue, an egg quality issue, that can actually influence your future health, and also how pregnancy can influence your future health. Pregnancy is sort of a stress test. So I think that really a lot of investment needs to be in femtech improving basic science, we think of basic science as some guy in a white coat in a lab doing research but there’s actually a growing number of women who are going into basic science who are interested in this, but there’s not a lot of funding. So how can femtech help enhance or improve the relationship with the lay world with basic science and help facilitate research recruitment and collaboration between basic science and femtech and those who might use femtech? And then for my clinical research of course I was focused on femtech and providing sexual health education for girls, especially young women of color, and I think there are a lot of health disparities that exist and one of the things people don’t appreciate is that, well it may not be happening to you, but health disparities basically suggest that there are people who have less value in the healthcare system and so that shouldn’t be. And I think femtech can be instrumental in eliminating those health disparities by giving those individuals data, their own data, that they can use to take to their healthcare provider, and what I think, what happens in that interaction is that healthcare providers who may not realize that they have bias, when they are presented with data, they can’t argue with data. Or if you know that this has been happening to you, you’re able to track that through our app, through Clue you can track 30 different symptoms, you can actually take that data and say you know what, this person is not listening to me, perhaps I should get a second opinion. And that’s OK. That’s in the right, that’s in the purview of the person who is coming to get care.
Kathy: Well, Lynae, thank you so much, this was a great conversation.
Lynae: Thank you, I appreciate the time, and stay safe.
Kathy: Thank you for joining me for this episode of the Smarter Healthcare Podcast.
To learn more about Dr. Brayboy’s work at Clue, visit the company on Twitter @clue.
You can also follow me on Twitter @ksucich or @smarthcpodcast. Feel free to get in touch with comments or guest suggestions.
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